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Post by falcon8r on Feb 12, 2011 22:43:06 GMT -5
I've been playing Crusade a lot lately, due to Classic mode testing, and I am starting to believe that Air Dodges are too good. It's very hard to punish Air Dodges in this game (unlike Brawl), which could lead to a lot of "air camping", jumping around in the air and dodging or throwing out quick aerials.
Here's a frame data breakdown for a typical air dodge:
frame 3: invincibility starts
frame 18: invincibility ends
frame 32: air dodge ends
Based on this and your experience playing, do you think Air Dodges are too good?
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Post by DGN on Feb 12, 2011 22:45:39 GMT -5
I'll have to test it out. I don't use them too much.
Honestly, its only for dodging the overpowered enemies final smash skillz.
I say its fine, similar to brawl, but I'm not going to cast my vote yet.
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Post by Dettadeus on Feb 12, 2011 22:46:49 GMT -5
I personally think they're fine. They feel just like Brawl's (especially when I'm playing Jiggs, since I love my little jump-air dodge method of moving around).
If need be, you could make the invincibility end earlier, but it feels fine to me.
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phantomhp
Forum Regular
rogue artist
Posts: 389
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Post by phantomhp on Feb 12, 2011 22:46:17 GMT -5
I notice that computers especially at later levels are pro at air dodging to the point where nothing will hit them. You definitely could be onto something with this.
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Post by sumika on Feb 12, 2011 22:53:37 GMT -5
I have problems using them actually. I dunno. I say dont change it though. Its good to mess up sometimes and get it right the others.
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Post by falcon8r on Feb 12, 2011 23:49:59 GMT -5
Hm, well, I have one vote for each choice so far, and based on your opinions, maybe I should only change it by one frame or so?
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Post by Dettadeus on Feb 12, 2011 23:53:19 GMT -5
In which direction? I don't think I'd notice if it's just one frame, so feel free to shorten it or something.
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Post by PartisanDaw on Feb 13, 2011 3:48:03 GMT -5
They dodge EVERY F****** TIME when i try to Spike them !!
Overpowered,that's my vote.
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Post by falcon8r on Feb 13, 2011 15:33:34 GMT -5
Haha, well okay... So far, it seems like there's only one vote to change it.
What I was thinking about doing was making it one or two frames longer, so that at the end, there's more time to punish.
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Post by gigapichu on Feb 13, 2011 18:57:31 GMT -5
I was actually able to regular dodge across Final destination with the opponent hounding me, and I never got hit. I never tried air dodging with that, though.
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Post by falcon8r on Feb 13, 2011 22:37:28 GMT -5
I was actually able to regular dodge across Final destination with the opponent hounding me, and I never got hit. I never tried air dodging with that, though. Uh, yeah. It should be nerfed.  |
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Post by diego222 on Feb 15, 2011 0:04:07 GMT -5
I think you should increase the ending time as you say but a little bit more than one or two frames and also do the same for the ground down-dodge.
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Post by falcon8r on Feb 15, 2011 8:30:02 GMT -5
For the ground dodge? Okay, I suppose. Couldn't hurt. Ground dodges have always been broken in Smash anyway. IMO.
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Post by diego222 on Feb 15, 2011 22:41:11 GMT -5
For the ground dodge? Okay, I suppose. Couldn't hurt. Ground dodges have always been broken in Smash anyway. IMO. Haha you got a point there. And also (kind of a bit off topic) I think the side ground dodge needs to be fixed in regards to the ending position of a character when it does a side roll towards the same direction it is facing. Like for example if im facing right and I do a side ground dodge to the right, the character should end up facing left and viceversa like in every smash game. While in Crusade if Im facing right and I do a side roll towards the same direction the character ends still looking to the right. |
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Post by Werekill on Feb 16, 2011 13:14:37 GMT -5
For the ground dodge? Okay, I suppose. Couldn't hurt. Ground dodges have always been broken in Smash anyway. IMO. Eh? How are they broken? They're very easily punishable, especially if your opponent overuses them. But yeah, air dodges are a bit op in Crusade. Just increase the ending lag, and it should be fine. |
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Post by falcon8r on Feb 16, 2011 14:35:46 GMT -5
Haha you got a point there. And also (kind of a bit off topic) I think the side ground dodge needs to be fixed in regards to the ending position of a character when it does a side roll towards the same direction it is facing. Like for example if im facing right and I do a side ground dodge to the right, the character should end up facing left and viceversa like in every smash game. While in Crusade if Im facing right and I do a side roll towards the same direction the character ends still looking to the right. I fixed this, but the game hasn't been uploaded yet. Also, the movement on Rolls has changed. You start out slow (for the first few frames), then go fast, and then slow down just before stopping. The distance covered is about 90% of what it used to be (except for Yoshi, who has about the same distance). Roll dodge speeds are about the same across the cast, although some characters, such as Sonic and Pikachu, have faster ones. |
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Post by diego222 on Feb 16, 2011 21:33:16 GMT -5
Thats cool! And about roll dodge speeds and distances, If I remember correctly also some characters had slower or longer roll dodges like Samus.
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Post by falcon8r on Feb 17, 2011 13:26:38 GMT -5
Yes, hers is a bit slower. I still have yet to individualize the animation lengths for all characters. It's a lot of annoying stuff.
So yeah, air dodge += 3 more lag frames. That seems to be the right amount to me.
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Post by DGN on Feb 17, 2011 20:43:39 GMT -5
not on topic with air dodges, but might as well put this here anyways.
When making a ground dodge, you have to simultaneously press down and shield.
In Brawl, you could hold the shield for as long as you want, and at anytime you can press down to dodge.
Please make it like brawl.
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Post by Dettadeus on Feb 18, 2011 1:11:38 GMT -5
Generic: It works just like in brawl. You must have a weird button map or something.
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