Pichu for DLC

[StayPuft]

At least they aren't suggestions for characters like...

*GREEN SONIC*

or

*RED SONIC*

or even

*IRATE GAMER*

I mean, most characters that are suggested are people's favorite characters, and that is why they suggest them, to get them into the game somehow. I'm sure that you've had characters that you wanted into the game not make it; IIRC Frank West was cut.

But that is the reason for DLC; so people can play as characters that aren't in the game normally, aka to please the fans. Not wanting Pichu as DLC only pisses some fans off, and that isn't always the best thing to do. You wouldn't even have to do anything, Detta is suggesting to sprite everything and I'm pretty sure falcon8r would program him in because of him wanting Pichu.

[El Maiz]

May 13, 2011 5:52:40 GMT -5 -Dr.MarioX- said:

May 12, 2011 22:07:52 GMT -5 GoldenYuiitusin said:

He doesn't read everything.
He said that I "went to all the trouble just for Pichu" when I clearly said that I am not saying I want Pichu and don't care for him.

Like I said, he doesn't care about you.

Well that's obviously manipulating everything I sent you in that message. I said the suggestions made on this site are ridiculous, especially for characters.

Yeah, I mean, like, Zoroark? Who wants to play as a Pokemon representing the newest games?
And Ratchet? Who would EVER play as someone representing a console that outsold the Wii, PS3, and 360 PUT TOGETHER?
And Gooey? Why on Earth would you play as some stupid blob of-- OH WAIIT.

[GoldenYuiitusin]

May 13, 2011 5:52:40 GMT -5 -Dr.MarioX- said:

May 12, 2011 22:07:52 GMT -5 GoldenYuiitusin said:

He doesn't read everything.
He said that I "went to all the trouble just for Pichu" when I clearly said that I am not saying I want Pichu and don't care for him.

Like I said, he doesn't care about you.

Well that's obviously manipulating everything I sent you in that message. I said the suggestions made on this site are ridiculous, especially for characters.

Yeah, because characters like Mach Rider, Ristar, Gooey, are not rediculous?
Gooey's an old obscure Kirby character that doesn't even have ARMS.
Both Risar and Mach have been in one game each, and TBH, no one really knows that they exist until they play Crusade.
Not only that, but you have to put up an extra effort just to give them a viable moveset. As compared to someone like Agumon, who is well known by fans, already has a base moveset (Digimon Rumble Arena 2) and brings something unique to the table with Greymon.

As for Rival Trainer, that's the worst of the bunch. Not only do you copy an existing character's gimmick, you add 3 of your favorites that are on the list of popular COMPETITIVE Pokemon.
You aren't "representing the games". Your representing TIERS. TR4Q! Rival Trainer Blue NEVER used those Pokemon, while guess what? Pokemon Trainer Red has uses the Pokemon he has!
Seriously, did you even THINK about what you're adding? Only Scizor is a viable choice. Gengar's frigging light and would have to be a Glass Cannon to stand a chance, and Aggron is almost 800lbs! No character is Smash is NEAR that, save for maybe Giga Bowser. Aggron even jumps over the edge, and it falls to it's death instantly.

And don't get me started on the fail that is replacing Zero with Protoman...

And then there are the *Corrected* Mistakes like Aero.
I mean, sure you grew up with Aero (probably) and you think he's cool, but that doesn't mean that he should be a playable character. I mean, I grew up with Cold Shadow, yet I don't want Maui Mallard in Crusade, even though he'd be an epic character.
I don't even have to mention the choices in the "Superstar Gang"...


So, this is essentially irony at it's best.

[DGN]

If he wouldn't mind saying it, I'd also like to bring up the fact that DMX rated Rival's pokemon with all 5's, and Deoxys and Meowth with all 5's except a 4.5 for Moveset Potential for Deoxys, and 4.5 for uniqueness on Meowth.

But seriously, what's the point of moveset potential? If its ANYTHING in real life, a person could make a moveset for them.
YEAH! CANDY CANE FOR CRUSADE!


Also, Aggron is in the underused environment.

[El Maiz]

I also want to point out that the grading system is inaccurate.
I see how Frank West got fives in all, but he still shouldn't be in Crusade.

[GoldenYuiitusin]

I personally DON'T see how Frank can get a perfect score.

It seems more like who scored him was blinded by fanboyism.
I like Mike Haggar and all, but I didn't give him a perfect score. I gave him a fair grade.

[StayPuft]

I try to give fair grades when I use the scoring system.
Actually, I'd like to try right now.

Representation: 4.5
Pichu represents the Pokémon series, more importantly, second generation, and is the only Pokémon as of right now to have done so in Smash. Second generation is also arguably one of the best ones, according to fans. However, Pichu obviously isn't the most popular Pokémon from 2nd generation, though he is also well known because he is a pre-evo of Pikachu.

Popularity: 5
Many know him because of his appearances in the anime, his relationship to Pikachu, and some HG/SS Pichu-specific events. Definitely one of the most recognizable Pokémon.

Moveset Potential: 4.5
Pichu's level-up moveset is fairly limited, though by TMs, HMS, and egg moves, he has quite the arsenal of moves to choose from. Heck, all Pokémon (except obvious ones like Magikarp and Wurmple) have a good set of moves to be used in movesets.

Uniqueness: 3.5
It IS true Pichu is the pre-evolution of Pikachu, that hurts him a little bit in this category. However, just because he was a clone in Melee doesn't mean that he can't be un-cloned and be created into a completely new character. Hurting himself IS unique, though I'd think that it isn't a very desirable unique trait to have.

Overall: 87.5/100

I'd say that is good enough for a DLC character.

[Dettadeus]

I'm pretty sure I've said this somewhere before, but the way I see it:
The roster is what the devs all agree should be the characters in the main game.
DLC should be the characters that the fans wanted (and usually could help make) but were refused a place on the roster for one reason or another.
Both parties are happy. Devs get their choices in the main roster, fans get their choices as DLC (but they have to make it happen).

[GoldenYuiitusin]

I'm fine as long as Rival Trainer and Protoman are gone.

Replace them with Meowth and Zero and I will have no more complaints.

[ensane]

Lol, that's practically saying "Do what I want and I'll be happy."

[StayPuft]

Nah, if he got what he wanted, he'd have his entire SSB4 roster the roster for Crusade. Plus Haggar, Agumon/Greymon, and some others.
Those are just his main two complaints he has with the roster at the moment.

[GoldenYuiitusin]

May 14, 2011 9:37:55 GMT -5 StayPuft said:

Nah, if he got what he wanted, he'd have his entire SSB4 roster the roster for Crusade. Plus Haggar, Agumon/Greymon, and some others.
Those are just his main two complaints he has with the roster at the moment.

Exactly. I couldn't care less if Agumon or Haggar weren't in the roster, but only if they are given LEGITIMATE reasons for their exclusion.
But, with Rival Trainer and Protoman, there's problems.

[Dettadeus]

May 14, 2011 10:34:35 GMT -5 GoldenYuiitusin said:

I couldn't care less if Agumon or Haggar weren't in the roster, but only if they are given LEGITIMATE reasons for their exclusion.

This. This so VERY MUCH. This is sort of the case with Pichu and the Minister for me. If they're not going to be in, I need actual reasons before I'll stop pushing for them. So far all their reasons besides spriting have been crap.

EDIT: Got bored and started on the editing. I have the crouch done (it's an animation with bubbles, just like in Melee), and have to add the electrical effects to his d-air.

EDIT AGAIN:


I've decided that Pichu's F-Air will be a spike or meteor smash as Iron Tail.

EDIT AGAIN AGAIN: F-Air is finished.


E.A.A.A.: Posted on the SWF thread.

[El Maiz]

They didn't HAVE any reasons beside spriting.

[Dettadeus]

F-Smash is now complete:

Next up is Endure and Flail.
I'm not doing these in any particular order, btw.

EDIT: Endure and Flail:

[SmashKing201]

I do think that pichu should be considered for a second chance, but only if he can be decloned a bit

[El Maiz]

Does Endure give you Super Armor for just one hit, or for the entire duration.

If it's the former, multi-hit attacks can be a problem.

[StayPuft]

IIRC endure in the Pokémon games can protect from multiple hit moves, so it should last the entire duration here.

[Dettadeus]

I decided on the smashworld thread that it should give you about a second of invincibility so you can either get out of the way or attack. Or perhaps there's a way to make it so you can't attack while invincible from it, because otherwise you could pull off a risk-free flail right after Endure. In essence, yes, it is temporary super armor.

Also, @smashking: Um. What. Did you read the OP? Pichu's going to be at least 60% de-cloned.

Anyways, I think I'll do a bit of grading myself:
Representation: 5. We currently have no representatives (planned or otherwise) for 2nd generation, and Pichu fits the bill. Not to mention he was a Melee vet.
Popularity: 5. Adorable pre-evo of Pikachu, was Junichi Masuda's (the director of the Pokemon games) favorite Pokemon until Victini was made, (the spiky eared version) had an important role in the 12th Pokemon movie, and has had multiple events starring it.
Moveset Potential: 3.5-4. It's moveset isn't all that great, but for a baby Pokemon it's pretty large. Sure, anything it can do a Pikachu can through evolution, but that doesn't mean Pichu's moveset would be the same considering how much hasn't been used.
Uniqueness: 4. Again, the pre-evo of Pikachu, so that takes away something. However, it's self-damaging nature makes for complicated and intricate strategies and workarounds and separates it from Pikachu. It's planned moveset also provides for an advantage gained from damaging itself, and that is Flail.

Total: 18. Last I heard, there are characters on the roster that have gotten worse than this.

[El Maiz]

Wait, invincible or Super Armor?